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Quote from Guest on May 3, 2022, 11:30 pmPlease focus more services/funds on “facilitation” rather than “recruitment”. Patients (especially really sick ones) want assistance participating in the study, not to answer a marketing referral only to be forgotten about the minute they sign consent. Focus on transportation assistance, child care, contacting employers, preventing any financial toxicity, etc. Often it feels like “patient recruitment campaigns” are designed to be billable, not effective.
Please focus more services/funds on “facilitation” rather than “recruitment”. Patients (especially really sick ones) want assistance participating in the study, not to answer a marketing referral only to be forgotten about the minute they sign consent. Focus on transportation assistance, child care, contacting employers, preventing any financial toxicity, etc. Often it feels like “patient recruitment campaigns” are designed to be billable, not effective.
Quote from brad on May 3, 2022, 11:42 pmQuote from Guest on May 3, 2022, 11:30 pmPlease focus more services/funds on “facilitation” rather than “recruitment”. Patients (especially really sick ones) want assistance participating in the study, not to answer a marketing referral only to be forgotten about the minute they sign consent. Focus on transportation assistance, child care, contacting employers, preventing any financial toxicity, etc. Often it feels like “patient recruitment campaigns” are designed to be billable, not effective.
I think this is a really well said point. At the site level, these are things I consider all part of the recruitment process I suppose.
We provide travel and always fight for money in our budgets to ensure adequate compensation for the patients.
It's frustrating when sponsors don't appreciate these points and won't cooperate. We often use our own funds when a sponsor won't play along.
What else do you suggest we can do from both the site and sponsor side?
Quote from Guest on May 3, 2022, 11:30 pmPlease focus more services/funds on “facilitation” rather than “recruitment”. Patients (especially really sick ones) want assistance participating in the study, not to answer a marketing referral only to be forgotten about the minute they sign consent. Focus on transportation assistance, child care, contacting employers, preventing any financial toxicity, etc. Often it feels like “patient recruitment campaigns” are designed to be billable, not effective.
I think this is a really well said point. At the site level, these are things I consider all part of the recruitment process I suppose.
We provide travel and always fight for money in our budgets to ensure adequate compensation for the patients.
It's frustrating when sponsors don't appreciate these points and won't cooperate. We often use our own funds when a sponsor won't play along.
What else do you suggest we can do from both the site and sponsor side?
Quote from Guest on May 4, 2022, 12:04 amThis should all be about sponsor or CRO. Sites should not have to plan for facilitating volunteer patient participation, and certainly NEVER absorb such a cost. Yet it happens… a lot. This is a sponsor’s cost… every study, every phase, every therapeutic area, every patient… end of story. If the sponsor isn’t investing heavily in the patient volunteers, then they will continue on the same poor enrollment track that’s plagued our industry since the beginning.
This should all be about sponsor or CRO. Sites should not have to plan for facilitating volunteer patient participation, and certainly NEVER absorb such a cost. Yet it happens… a lot. This is a sponsor’s cost… every study, every phase, every therapeutic area, every patient… end of story. If the sponsor isn’t investing heavily in the patient volunteers, then they will continue on the same poor enrollment track that’s plagued our industry since the beginning.
Quote from brad on May 4, 2022, 12:21 amQuote from Guest on May 4, 2022, 12:04 amThis should all be about sponsor or CRO. Sites should not have to plan for facilitating volunteer patient participation, and certainly NEVER absorb such a cost. Yet it happens… a lot. This is a sponsor’s cost… every study, every phase, every therapeutic area, every patient… end of story. If the sponsor isn’t investing heavily in the patient volunteers, then they will continue on the same poor enrollment track that’s plagued our industry since the beginning.
I don't disagree but it's a weird spot to be in as a site. I can just spend an extra $50 or whatever to get them here or I won't get to see them at all. It's a damn shame for sponsors to pass the buck but they so often miss the forest for the trees so it's not surprising.
Quote from Guest on May 4, 2022, 12:04 amThis should all be about sponsor or CRO. Sites should not have to plan for facilitating volunteer patient participation, and certainly NEVER absorb such a cost. Yet it happens… a lot. This is a sponsor’s cost… every study, every phase, every therapeutic area, every patient… end of story. If the sponsor isn’t investing heavily in the patient volunteers, then they will continue on the same poor enrollment track that’s plagued our industry since the beginning.
I don't disagree but it's a weird spot to be in as a site. I can just spend an extra $50 or whatever to get them here or I won't get to see them at all. It's a damn shame for sponsors to pass the buck but they so often miss the forest for the trees so it's not surprising.
Quote from CJO on May 4, 2022, 4:38 amI had a hard time to just reply on one of the already made comments. Hence, my comment in general.
What drives me **** is the fact that sponsors or CRO take our strong proprietary volunteer database for granted, and consider it for free. Often heard phrase - "You have this database, why don't you just use it?" This actually is in my world bullying already.
It takes a lot of planning, efforts (community outreach, events, marketing campaigns etc.) to build and maintain a solid volunteer database including all those wonderful well captured details for each volunteer/subject including medical records and more. Why would we as independent, privately site give that away for free? Actually, those sponsors and CR are right "WE own this database!"
Our due diligence for pre-filtering potential study candidates has a value and need to be paid for.
And additionally, paying us for the calls to be made to get those subjects scheduled should be a no brainer, but it is. It is NOT done with one call only. We tracked our call statistics and were quite amazed how much time our recruitment team spends to schedule people, to reschedule, to substitute (for the still high numbers of no-shows & for SF).
We created a per subject flat rate - we tracked call time - we did it all. Most of the big pharma sponsors just mix marketing with recruitment and offer such ridiculous budgets like $5K flat/max for all to be enrolled subjects. No matter if we are supposed to enroll 1 or 4 or 10 or more. What is wrong in this picture?
Recruitment services (and I do not refer to marketing campaigns!- That is something completely different!) need to be valued and paid for. In particular when we are enrolling the pediatric population, what is an additional steep undertaking because those precious gems age out by the day!
How do you all handle that topic in your budgets? Did you evaluate your expenses to enroll/schedule valid candidates?
I had a hard time to just reply on one of the already made comments. Hence, my comment in general.
What drives me **** is the fact that sponsors or CRO take our strong proprietary volunteer database for granted, and consider it for free. Often heard phrase - "You have this database, why don't you just use it?" This actually is in my world bullying already.
It takes a lot of planning, efforts (community outreach, events, marketing campaigns etc.) to build and maintain a solid volunteer database including all those wonderful well captured details for each volunteer/subject including medical records and more. Why would we as independent, privately site give that away for free? Actually, those sponsors and CR are right "WE own this database!"
Our due diligence for pre-filtering potential study candidates has a value and need to be paid for.
And additionally, paying us for the calls to be made to get those subjects scheduled should be a no brainer, but it is. It is NOT done with one call only. We tracked our call statistics and were quite amazed how much time our recruitment team spends to schedule people, to reschedule, to substitute (for the still high numbers of no-shows & for SF).
We created a per subject flat rate - we tracked call time - we did it all. Most of the big pharma sponsors just mix marketing with recruitment and offer such ridiculous budgets like $5K flat/max for all to be enrolled subjects. No matter if we are supposed to enroll 1 or 4 or 10 or more. What is wrong in this picture?
Recruitment services (and I do not refer to marketing campaigns!- That is something completely different!) need to be valued and paid for. In particular when we are enrolling the pediatric population, what is an additional steep undertaking because those precious gems age out by the day!
How do you all handle that topic in your budgets? Did you evaluate your expenses to enroll/schedule valid candidates?
Quote from FDL on May 4, 2022, 10:48 pmWe typically do not need advertising for enrollment. So we will ask to reimburse for hours spent pre qualifying patients from our database. If I get push back on that I tell them to pay us for finding actual patients that will randomize as opposed to advertising patients that can be a crap shoot.
We typically do not need advertising for enrollment. So we will ask to reimburse for hours spent pre qualifying patients from our database. If I get push back on that I tell them to pay us for finding actual patients that will randomize as opposed to advertising patients that can be a crap shoot.
Quote from brad on May 5, 2022, 2:37 amQuote from FDL on May 4, 2022, 10:48 pmWe typically do not need advertising for enrollment. So we will ask to reimburse for hours spent pre qualifying patients from our database. If I get push back on that I tell them to pay us for finding actual patients that will randomize as opposed to advertising patients that can be a crap shoot.
How do you structure your prescreening fee? Hourly? Per patient? Lump sum?
Quote from FDL on May 4, 2022, 10:48 pmWe typically do not need advertising for enrollment. So we will ask to reimburse for hours spent pre qualifying patients from our database. If I get push back on that I tell them to pay us for finding actual patients that will randomize as opposed to advertising patients that can be a crap shoot.
How do you structure your prescreening fee? Hourly? Per patient? Lump sum?
Quote from brad on May 5, 2022, 2:39 amQuote from CJO on May 4, 2022, 4:38 amI had a hard time to just reply on one of the already made comments. Hence, my comment in general.
What drives me **** is the fact that sponsors or CRO take our strong proprietary volunteer database for granted, and consider it for free. Often heard phrase - "You have this database, why don't you just use it?" This actually is in my world bullying already.
It takes a lot of planning, efforts (community outreach, events, marketing campaigns etc.) to build and maintain a solid volunteer database including all those wonderful well captured details for each volunteer/subject including medical records and more. Why would we as independent, privately site give that away for free? Actually, those sponsors and CR are right "WE own this database!"
Our due diligence for pre-filtering potential study candidates has a value and need to be paid for.
And additionally, paying us for the calls to be made to get those subjects scheduled should be a no brainer, but it is. It is NOT done with one call only. We tracked our call statistics and were quite amazed how much time our recruitment team spends to schedule people, to reschedule, to substitute (for the still high numbers of no-shows & for SF).
We created a per subject flat rate - we tracked call time - we did it all. Most of the big pharma sponsors just mix marketing with recruitment and offer such ridiculous budgets like $5K flat/max for all to be enrolled subjects. No matter if we are supposed to enroll 1 or 4 or 10 or more. What is wrong in this picture?
Recruitment services (and I do not refer to marketing campaigns!- That is something completely different!) need to be valued and paid for. In particular when we are enrolling the pediatric population, what is an additional steep undertaking because those precious gems age out by the day!
How do you all handle that topic in your budgets? Did you evaluate your expenses to enroll/schedule valid candidates?
We don't do a good job at quantifying this currently. How you structure requests for covering all this front end work?
Quote from CJO on May 4, 2022, 4:38 amI had a hard time to just reply on one of the already made comments. Hence, my comment in general.
What drives me **** is the fact that sponsors or CRO take our strong proprietary volunteer database for granted, and consider it for free. Often heard phrase - "You have this database, why don't you just use it?" This actually is in my world bullying already.
It takes a lot of planning, efforts (community outreach, events, marketing campaigns etc.) to build and maintain a solid volunteer database including all those wonderful well captured details for each volunteer/subject including medical records and more. Why would we as independent, privately site give that away for free? Actually, those sponsors and CR are right "WE own this database!"
Our due diligence for pre-filtering potential study candidates has a value and need to be paid for.
And additionally, paying us for the calls to be made to get those subjects scheduled should be a no brainer, but it is. It is NOT done with one call only. We tracked our call statistics and were quite amazed how much time our recruitment team spends to schedule people, to reschedule, to substitute (for the still high numbers of no-shows & for SF).
We created a per subject flat rate - we tracked call time - we did it all. Most of the big pharma sponsors just mix marketing with recruitment and offer such ridiculous budgets like $5K flat/max for all to be enrolled subjects. No matter if we are supposed to enroll 1 or 4 or 10 or more. What is wrong in this picture?
Recruitment services (and I do not refer to marketing campaigns!- That is something completely different!) need to be valued and paid for. In particular when we are enrolling the pediatric population, what is an additional steep undertaking because those precious gems age out by the day!
How do you all handle that topic in your budgets? Did you evaluate your expenses to enroll/schedule valid candidates?
We don't do a good job at quantifying this currently. How you structure requests for covering all this front end work?
Quote from Guest on May 6, 2022, 2:24 amWe primarily do pediatric studies and the time it takes to discuss a study at length so the parents are comfortable with the situation, visits, blood draws, study med is unbelievable. I never thought about billing for that time but its a great idea!
We primarily do pediatric studies and the time it takes to discuss a study at length so the parents are comfortable with the situation, visits, blood draws, study med is unbelievable. I never thought about billing for that time but its a great idea!
